More On The Time Warner Series 3 TiVo Issue
Update 08/04/2006 @ 8:57 PM EST: Time Warner Cable Raleigh, NC has apologized for providing misinformation!
Update 07/31 @ 9:22PM EST: TWC has contacted a user on TiVoCommunity.com to let him know that TWC will provide CableCARDs for the Series3 TiVo.
In case you don’t already know, Time Warner Cable in Raleigh, NC has said that they won’t support the Series 3 TiVo. Now it looks like TWC in Los Angeles (San Fernando Valley) is saying the same thing.
I received the following email from Phil which contains a response he received from TWC in Los Angeles (his email address has been removed upon his request).
To: Editors of Engadget, Gizmodo, ZatzNotFunny, TiVoBlog and Tivo Pony
re: TimeWarner in Los Angeles — NO Cable Card for Tivo Series 3Here’s the answer from Los Angeles Time Warner (San Fernando Valley)
A big fat NO.
Let’s light a fire under these guys — throw the FCC at ‘em whatever… who’s
with me?PK
[If you run this -- please remove my e-mail address.]
—— Forwarded Message
From: “Cust.Ops”
Reply-To: “Cust.Ops”
Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2006 18:45:36 -0700
To:
Subject: Re: FEEDBACK_Customer_Service (KMM1035923V50920L0KM)Hello
Thank you for your inquiry. We do offer Cable Card technology, however, we will not install Cable Cards onto equipment aside from the television itself.
We will not support any 3rd party equipment devices such as Tivo.
If you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us via our Live Online Help. Our Live Online Help Representatives are available Monday through Friday between 9 AM to 7 PM at:
http://www.TimeWarnerLA.com/chat/ .Time Warner Cable
(888)TW-CABLENow you can pay your bill online or with your digital remote! Just visit http://www.TimeWarnerLA.com/PayXpress or tune to channel 1 and select “Interact.”
Original Message Follows:
————————** THIS IS MESSAGE HAS BEEN FORWARDED BY THE ONLINE FEEDBACK SYSTEM **
TIME WARNER CABLE WEBSITE CUSTOMER FEEDBACK
Thursday, July 27, 2006, 10:35:47The following inquiry was received through the TimeWarnerCable website feedback form.
NAME: XXXXXXXX
E-MAIL: XXXXXX@XXXXX
PHONE: XXXXXXXXXXXXMESSAGE:
I am a current customer of Time Warner for Cable Modem service. For TV, I switched to satellite a few years ago — BUT I am expecting to return to Time Warner for Cable TV service later this year.However, my coming back to Time Warner is dependent on the answer to one very important question.
Will you be supporting CableCard installation in the new Series 3 TiVo which is about to come out? This is a CableLabs certified device and should fall under the FCC mandate for CableCard support.
I’ll be a customer of yours again, IF you will be supporting this. It all depends on whether the new TiVo Series 3 will have your CableCard support. Please let me know asap.
Best Regards,
XXXXX
What if anything can we do to fight this? Anybody know who we should contact? I’m willing to host a letter or email template that everybody can send to the FCC (if that’s who we should be contacting).
July 27th, 2006 at 11:18 pm |
[...] Update: 07/27 @ 11:16 PM: Looks like TWC in Los Angeles is saying the same thing… Update: 07/26 @ 9:58 PM: The consumerfury.com complaint has been updated. Apparently the individual who posted the complaint contacted the Raleigh Telecommunication Commission about the problem. The RTC replied back essentially saying that TW is under no obligation to support a CableCARD install in a Series 3 TiVo. Check out the complaint for more information and additional followup. [...]
July 28th, 2006 at 6:04 am |
Pretty crazy stuff… looks like a battle is brewing.
July 28th, 2006 at 8:28 am |
Vote with your feet people. Get a dish or something else. Cable companies won’t get it until they start feeling it in the bottom line, and simply complaining to them you will be ignored.
July 28th, 2006 at 8:52 am |
What’s the big deal? It looks like all they are saying is that they wont support it, not that you cant get a cable card and set it up yourself.
July 28th, 2006 at 9:14 am |
As much as I whine about Comcast at times, at least when it comes to TiVo, they seem to get it.
For the first time I’m happy I live in a Comcast area.
It just seems like Time-Warner is making a bad business decision as well as an unethical, and possibly illegal one.
Let’s see would I rather have someone pay ~$75-$100 a month and not get the extra $10 for renting the box, or not get anything because they get a dish instead?
Seems like a no brainer to me. I have a TV that has a CableCard slot so yes, I could just plug it in to the TiVo myself, but there is a principle involved here.
July 28th, 2006 at 9:28 am |
I’m not sure if it as simple as that. When I called my cable company they said that they needed to send somebody out to install it.
July 28th, 2006 at 11:14 am |
elmegil while I agree with the tactic of “voting with your feet” (or wallet) since the Series3 doesn’t support Satellite if your cable company won’t give you a CableCARD for the Series3 (assuming they can get away with it legally) you simply won’t be able to make usre of a Series3 at all, unless you consider moving to an area with a friendlier cable company an option.
Maceo, Alex is correct, it isn’t as simple as placing a CableCARD in the device and turning it on. CableCARD requires a technician visit where the card is installed and the card & device pair are registered with the network. I’m sure that a “self install” is possible but it’s unlikely that a cable company that wanted to block a TiVo would allow such a thing.
Interesting, I’m also in a Time Warner area, as a matter of fact Time Warner of the San Fernando Valley as well. I sent them a note the same day this news broke and have yet to recieve a reply from them.
I actually see a bright side to this, either this will force the FCCs hand to compel the cable companies to support the Series3 or it will force TiVo to make a Series3 that works with any system like the current Series2 Stand Alone does, all they would have to do is give it some inputs and an IR blaster.
As it is the current Series3 is only compatible with 2/3 to 3/4 (depending on which statistic you believe) of subscription TV households, if a significant portion of cable companies are able to successfully block the Series3 it could become a very marginal player.
July 28th, 2006 at 11:14 am |
You can’t move a cablecard from a TV to a Tivo. When installed the cablecard is “mated” to the serial number of the TV and will not work in any other TV or Tivo.
July 28th, 2006 at 1:26 pm |
I understand that but can a consumer install a CableCARD themselves or do they really need the cable companies support?
July 28th, 2006 at 2:18 pm |
I just exchanged e-mail with my local Comacst rep (SF Bay Area). This CSR stated they WOULD NOT support the Tivo CableCARD installation. I don’t know if she is simply unaware or if this is their standard policy. If the latter, that is very troubling.
John
July 28th, 2006 at 2:33 pm |
whats the big deal if it wont work with your tivo. #1 tivo is associated with a dish so if you want to use your tivo get a dish.
July 28th, 2006 at 3:25 pm |
It all comes down to what they mean by “support”. Does support mean that they won’t perform the install or does it mean that they won’t “support” you if you have problems?
July 28th, 2006 at 5:48 pm |
I don’t want to switch from cable to dish, or vice versa, just because someone is ignorant of FCC regulations on their industry… series 3 is most useful with cablecard installed, and FCC requires it be supported. time warner can kiss my …
July 28th, 2006 at 9:32 pm |
#1 tivo is associated with a dish so if you want to use your tivo get a dish.
What are you smoking? TiVo doesn’t sell either dish or cable. Currently NO commercial dish or cable provider supplies TiVos, though we keep hearing rumors about Comcast cable….
I rescind my former comments as well; I guess I wasn’t paying close enough attention to the Series 3 specs. TiVo making themselves dependent on 3rd party hardware being registered with the provider seems a recipe for exactly this sort of problem.
July 28th, 2006 at 10:45 pm |
To those of you who keep ignorantly advising those of us who have cable to drop it and get a dish - when will you acknowledge that not everyone lives in a house, in the suburbs? I live in NYC, in a large apartment building. Satellite isn’t an option. The co-op board won’t permit a dish, nor will the landmark preservation board (our building is landmarked). Individually we can choose between Time Warner cable or rabbit ears. We’ll stick with cable, thanks.
July 29th, 2006 at 1:31 pm |
Does anyone know how we can legally press this issue? I mean how about a class action lawsuit for all the subscribers of Time Warner against Time Warner? I’m sure there has to be a lawyer out there ready to take up this cause, as they are violating FCC regulations, on a loophole the calls the device a TV, versus a 3rd party device. Why not install a simple monitor on the Tivo Series 3 then, and we can call it a TV?
I’m a Time Warner customer who’s been waiting for the last two years to get a Tivo Series 3, and this is truly monopolistic and anti-competitive, and anti-consumer.
Any Lawyers in the house?
Chris
July 29th, 2006 at 6:22 pm |
Realistically, this will be resolved by the time the series 3 launches. In the meantime, it will be a question of how big of a black eye Time Warner gets for posturing and trying to dissaude people from going the TiVo route.
Time Warner is required to abide by FCC regulations, because they are operating services regulated by the FCC. If _you_ have been told by Time Warner, or any other cable company, that they will not provide you with a CableCard for a CableLabs certified third party device, then you should file a complaint with the FCC with the full information regarding that, as well as writing a letter to the head of your local Time Warner affiliate and someone at the VP level of Time Warner.
If you are among those of us following this from the sidelines, wondering why Time Warner’s head is firmly entrenched where the sun doesn’t shine, well, continue watching, and feel free to ask any/all of your local cable providers whether they will provide CableCard for third-party CableLabs certified devices, i.e. not just TV’s.
July 30th, 2006 at 3:52 am |
Alex,
Yes, the cablecard must be activated to function using a registration screen and some number sent to the cableco. It would be possible to do this yourself but I suspect that the cableco wants to verify the device in which the card is installed is authentic and allowed to use the cablecard.
July 31st, 2006 at 11:00 am |
I think the whole thing amounts to “won’t support” or “won’t allow” Support has a lot of meanings. It can mean they will not set it up themselves, and will they will not help you with any problems you have with the unit to get it working (Much like not helping a customer setup their VCR) Or it could mean that they only allow their tech to install the cards, and they will not install it in these units and def facto, the will not allow you to use a Series 3.
I expect TW is taking this opportunity to scare as many people into getting one of thier units until the Series 3 is released. Then it will become clear exactly what they mean, and they will be forced to allow these devices on their network in some fashion.
July 31st, 2006 at 11:50 am |
tim,
I think you are right but the scary thing about it is that I’d hate to buy a Series3 TiVo only to find out that TW won’t install the CableCARD and they won’t allow me to install it. Know what I mean?
July 31st, 2006 at 9:21 pm |
[...] Alex: tim, I think you are right but… [...]
August 2nd, 2006 at 6:27 pm |
Anyone know if there are other cableco’s that are not wanting to provide a cablecard for the S3? I am with Mediacom who seems to be reluctant in these matters?
June 2nd, 2007 at 4:26 am |
Your worst fears have come true….
I have a Tivo Series 3 and I live in Los Angeles. Time Warner Cable is now saying that CableCARD is not available in this area and will not be made available anytime soon.
I’m turning the FCC on them (I have access to really good class action lawyers).
June 2nd, 2007 at 2:42 pm |
I find this hard to believe. Did you ask to talk with somebody else? Sometimes you just need to talk with the right person. I need to call TWC later in the week for my S3 TiVo. I’ll be sure to keep everybody informed with how it goes.
June 20th, 2007 at 8:18 pm |
Time Warner has a cable in my yard that needs to be buried for over a month now. Your calls don’t get returned and they are arrogant when you speak with them. They want to charge to more for less service. Whatever happened to “the customer is always right”? It’s a shame this company doesnt care about its customers.
July 2nd, 2007 at 1:06 am |
Is this site only for TiVO problems?If so, where can I post a terrible problem talking to a Time Warner customer service rep AND the repair service rep. Someone on top needs to hear and address my problem, which I’m certain isn’t a rare case.
Thanks in advance if ANYONE can direct me to the right blog site! HELP. Those recorded ‘helper recorded assistants’ need to be BANNED FROM THE PHONE SYSTEM - these COMPANIES DON’T CARE A HILL OF BEANS ABOUT THEIR CUSTOMERS! Anyone out there who feels the same???
November 4th, 2007 at 3:55 pm |
In Hollywood here… had to fight (10…12…15 calls to TW) to get cablecards (no multipass available). They were installed into Series3… Maybe it helps if you don’t tell them it’s TiVo cause I don’t think the installer cares about that.
Total pain…but stay feisty & you might get your way… and fight to have that $20 installation fee credited… Of course it ALL depends on who answers the 888-TWCABLE call.
saylahv